[MLA] MLA web site

Kevin Gross kevin.gross at avanw.com
Thu Dec 14 00:36:59 CET 2017 

Looks right to me

Kevin Gross - AVA Networks

On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 7:56 AM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:

> I like it!
>
>
> Bob
>
>
>
> On 12/11/17 9:57 AM, Robin Reumers wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Apologies for the delay in responding, it has been hectic here. I've made
> a mockup (see attached) of the site. It would have:
> - Home which has an intro (could be the text from the old website) and
> below it some news items, for example in this case the Tidal announcement.
> Every time there is something worth mentioning, it can be updated.
> - About Us: explains what the group is about (objectives) and maybe a bit
> about all of you. Up to you of course.
> - Papers: A list of all papers, when clicked it will open a PDF reader but
> also next to it a button to download the PDF if they want to read it in
> their own viewer
> - Links: the old weblinks from the old website
> - Contact us page: a form with CAPTCHA to be emailed to someone (could be
> Florian if you'd like). This way, the email address will never be visible.
>
> Please let me know if you have any remarks or comments and we'll move onto
> the design if everyone agrees.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Robin
>
> On Fri, Dec 1, 2017 at 6:02 PM, Kevin Gross <kevin.gross at avanw.com> wrote:
>
>> I think, as a first step, we're looking to rebuild the content on the
>> site before we were hacked. There's a good copy on the Wayback machine -
>> https://web.archive.org/web/20170201231348/http://www.music-loudness.com/
>>
>> We did not have a news section before. If we do add one I think it is
>> likely to be updated just a few times a year.
>>
>> We did have a weblinks section with some reasonable content. We should
>> probably review that to make sure it is still reasonable and to address any
>> link rot issues.
>>
>> One piece of content we should add (to the papers section) is a copy of
>> Eelco's Tidal paper - https://octo.hku.nl/octo/rep
>> ository/getfile?id=qLlZPGSVXFM
>>
>> Maybe a website-based PDF viewer is a good idea. Most browsers have this
>> capability now. For this reason, I think a simple link to a PDF is adequate.
>>
>> Kevin Gross - AVA Networks
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 2:48 PM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I got five responses immediately on facebook. The winner I think is
>>> Robin Reumers. He's willing to do it for free. I have to see if that
>>> includes maintenance and security. I endorse Robin 1000%. He knows
>>> everything about everything. He was my assistant for two years, general
>>> manager of two SAE schools, is now a founder of Abbey Road Institute, has
>>> founded a plugin company and was chief operating officer of Galaxy Studios.
>>> I got him the job at Galaxy!
>>>
>>> In fact,  Robin is visiting here this weekend so we could discuss this.
>>> I'll keep you informed.
>>>
>>> Best
>>>
>>> Bob
>>>
>>> My iPhone made me write this. Quotes only below this line. Nothing more
>>> to see here.
>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> On Nov 14, 2017, at 3:55 PM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I posted on my FB page.  Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Kevin's idea
>>> about depending on backups to deal with security has some merit because
>>> it's going to be a largely static site.
>>>
>>> The thing is if a hack happens then you need the expert to keep it from
>>> happening again. And that's where it gets costly. Reloading from a backup
>>> is all well and good but where do you go from there when it gets hacked?
>>>
>>> Here's my post:
>>>
>>> Any website developers willing to watch over a non-profit audio-related
>>> educational site for a yearly honorarium?  We might put your name on the
>>> page if it's helpful.
>>>
>>> Kevin Gross, Eelco Grimm, Bob Ludwig, Ian Shepherd, Florian Camerer
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> My iPhone made me write this. Quotes only below this line. Nothing more
>>> to see here.
>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> On Nov 14, 2017, at 3:46 PM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I'll ask on Facebook.
>>>
>>> Bob
>>>
>>> My iPhone made me write this. Quotes only below this line. Nothing more
>>> to see here.
>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> On Nov 14, 2017, at 3:32 PM, Grimm | Eelco <eelco at grimmaudio.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Bob and Kevin,
>>>
>>> So the problem is the security. My students cannot offer that (just
>>> setting the thing up - pretty straightforward work). And no one on this
>>> list has time for it.
>>>
>>> There are two solutions:
>>> 1. We hire someone to look after security of a Wordpress site on the
>>> digido domain.
>>> 2. We rent a site at Weebly - yes they take care of security since that
>>> is their core business. If we accept some "made with Weebly" banners it is
>>> free, otherwise I think the €7/month option fits all our needs, which is
>>> €84/year.
>>>
>>> If we can find someone who can take care of security (updates etc) of a
>>> Wordpress site for €100 / year or less, I'm very fine with the digido
>>> solution. Otherwise Weebly seems like a nice and cheaper choice. I could
>>> even live with "made with Weebly" banners btw.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Eelco
>>>
>>>
>>> On 14 nov. 2017, at 20:44, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The MLA is not paying for dns OR for a site. What part of "Free of
>>> charge" don't you understand? If you want a prefab, cookie cutter look, go
>>> to Weebly OR Squarespace and move from zero dollars (subsidized by yours
>>> truly that I'm paying a helluva lot for MLAs benefit). Any amateur or pro
>>> is free to build the MLA site here.
>>>
>>> Www.digido.com <http://www.digido.com/> is a fabulous, custom site.
>>> You'll be on the same host. All you have to do is design.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Bob K
>>>
>>> My iPhone made me write this. Quotes only below this line. Nothing more
>>> to see here.
>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> On Nov 14, 2017, at 12:33 PM, Kevin Gross <kevin.gross at avanw.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, I was proposing an amateur build the site. Security would be
>>> accomplished by a good backup that we can quickly restore from. If no one
>>> thinks this is a workable idea, I'm happy to move on. Despite potential
>>> bugaboos in the fine print, my second choice would be something like Weebly
>>> or Squarespace. My understanding is these are a bit more than a
>>> Wordpress instance.
>>>
>>> Kevin Gross - AVA Networks
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 10:21 AM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> If you want an amateur to build the site and "secure" it, no skin off
>>>> my back. There's no reason to pay Weebly or Squarespace because we already
>>>> have a site and I offer it free to the MLA. , and we're saving money
>>>> because I'm already paying the fees for the MLA. Just don't come back with
>>>> your tails between your legs if the site gets hacked or it isn't supported
>>>> adequately. All we need is design, maintenance and security.
>>>>
>>>> Hosting is hosting. Hosting is not security. Read the fine print at
>>>> Weebly and Squarespace. I'll bet they supply the site and maybe a wordpress
>>>> instance. But I'll also bet If you go into the site and start playing with
>>>> it, then you're responsible for its security and maintenance!
>>>>
>>>> If the guy we "hire" doesn't know how to set up an empty wordpress
>>>> instance himself, then he shouldn't be hired. That should be the minimum
>>>> requirement for technical competence. I'll provide the site, the dns and
>>>> the subdomain for staging, and any passwords or access codes that he or she
>>>> needs. I can even make an empty wordpress instance on our domain, but it
>>>> would not give me confidence to discover I had to do it because the guy we
>>>> "hire" couldn't do it himself!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Bob
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 11/14/17 11:18 AM, Kevin Gross wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hosting is a problem if hosting with you requires we engage a
>>>> professional to secure the site. Can you set us up an empty Wordpress
>>>> instance, have it backed up reliably and give Eelco access so that he can
>>>> get his student volunteers to populate it for us? If you're not comfortable
>>>> with this, and I'm not expecting you would be, I'm not sure I would be, we
>>>> should look at alternatives.
>>>>
>>>> Weebly does offer pro website hosting for $12/mo. Squarespace is
>>>> $18/mo. Presumably security and backup is taken care of for you on these
>>>> services. I think we should be able to scrape together the $200/yr required
>>>> to support this.
>>>>
>>>> Kevin Gross - AVA Networks
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 8:41 AM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Kevin. The site is not the problem! I continue to offer it to the
>>>>> group for free. The DNS is already pointing. All those aspects have been
>>>>> taken care of by me.
>>>>>
>>>>> Once again: The issue is design, security and maintenance. Anyone can
>>>>> design a wordpress site, but not everyone can offer security, guaranteed
>>>>> maintenance and upkeep. It has to be a package.... you can't have an
>>>>> amateur design it followed by a pro to maintain it.
>>>>>
>>>>> So if we find someone who knows how to do it, I'll guide him or her
>>>>> through the back end and even to the creation of a temporary subdomain for
>>>>> staging. All that is not a problem. I have that expertise and it's already
>>>>> being done for our site. I could set up a wordpress instance as well but
>>>>> like everyone on this list, I am an amateur. So we need design, maintenance
>>>>> and security. A package. Or we'll be hacked soon as you're born, just like
>>>>> every other amateur who sets up a wordpress site.
>>>>> Let's not be naive: We need someone with expertise to make it secure
>>>>> and to maintain it, keep all the mains and plugins up to date. Not a month
>>>>> goes by without one of my plugins or wordpress needing update. In many
>>>>> cases security issues come up and have to be responded to rapidly. That is
>>>>> not something you want someone casual to do. I'm very happy I have a pro
>>>>> maintaining those aspects of my site for me, I wear too many hats and so
>>>>> does everyone else on this list.
>>>>>
>>>>> I know how to set up wordpress backups, that's not an issue. I am
>>>>> already performing offsite backups using ftp to my local redundant server
>>>>> and will ensure that our new wordpress site is adequately backed up.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 11/14/17 9:31 AM, Kevin Gross wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Can we agree that the first step here is to get an empty Wordpress
>>>>> instance set up somewhere and establish a security and maintenance plan for
>>>>> it?
>>>>>
>>>>> I have room to do this for no additional cost at Hostmonster. I am no
>>>>> Wordpress expert but could set up a new empty instance based on the
>>>>> web-based systems provided by Hostmonster. I am not watching things like a
>>>>> hawk so it could get toasted again. But Hostmonster does regular automatic
>>>>> backups for each account so it could be restored or rebuilt elsewhere from
>>>>> backups.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kevin Gross - AVA Networks
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 7:01 AM, Bob Katz <bobkatz at digido.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear Eelco. Ultimately a professional is the best solution but my guy
>>>>>> is too expensive for us I think. I'm paying around $500 a year for his
>>>>>> maintenance and a few thousand for the initial design.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My site runs on a highly-customized WordPress. We do have Wordfence
>>>>>> running but I'm not a security expert. I do know there was more to our
>>>>>> security, including capcha, and on my host I am running extra security. I
>>>>>> have full access to the back-end and I have space for backup and am willing
>>>>>> with our group to contribute to the cost of some necessary plugins,
>>>>>> including updraft pro and maybe a few others.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I advise if you/we can find a very astute student volunteer who likes
>>>>>> audio and our goals, who is not into cookie cutter templates, who
>>>>>> understands PHP and has experience with security. Those would be the
>>>>>> economical ingredients. If he/she will keep the WordPress up and up to date
>>>>>> as a volunteer then we ask a group can volunteer to maintain the articles.
>>>>>> That's all I ask.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I pay for the site and I host the domain. I pay for the domain. I'm
>>>>>> more than happy to contribute to articles, but I have to draw the line
>>>>>> before site design, maintenance and security. For that we must choose a pro
>>>>>> or a pro equivalent, wisely and economically.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ian, I devised the original site in Joomla and then we got hacked
>>>>>> because I was not maintaining the joomla. I'm through with Joomla. I would
>>>>>> not advise using the way back machine or even my stored backup (if I could
>>>>>> find it) because more people are into WordPress these days and Joomla or
>>>>>> Drupal are long in the tooth. As Eelco points out, a good looking site in
>>>>>> WordPress can be put up in no time. We just want a pro or a competent geek
>>>>>> student to put it up, make it secure and keep it secure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are you watching over the back end of your site like a hawk, Ian?
>>>>>> Personally I feel quite a lot of peace of mind having my pro watch over my
>>>>>> site for a measly $500 a year. But I think that's a bit too much for
>>>>>> Music-Loudness to sustain, don't you?  Plus, my pro would not maintain a
>>>>>> site he didn't design, which seems reasonable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Reminds me of the old rate sheet:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> $25 an hour if I do it
>>>>>> $50 an hour if you watch
>>>>>> $100 if I do it and you help
>>>>>> $200 if you do it and I watch.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does this help?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bob
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My iPhone made me write this. Quotes only below this line. Nothing
>>>>>> more to see here.
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 13, 2017, at 7:37 PM, Ian Shepherd <ian at mastering-media.co.uk>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Bob,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All my sites (5 or 6) are running on Wordpress. I got hacked several
>>>>>> years ago so installed the free versions of Wordfence and iThemes Security
>>>>>> and have been secure ever since. Maybe Eelco’s students would keep an eye
>>>>>> on things for us ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Having said that, can we not pull the source code of the original
>>>>>> site from the Wayback Machine and re-install it ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ian
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 13 Nov 2017, at 23:27, Grimm | Eelco <eelco at grimmaudio.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Bob,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What do you suggest as solution? Is your current website based upon
>>>>>> Wordpress or some other CMS? We could maybe ask your professional to
>>>>>> maintain the MLA pages too - I'm willing to contribute to that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Eelco
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Guys. We have a domain, I've got control of it and I've been paying
>>>>>> for the domain renewals ever since we put it up  However, I cannot spend
>>>>>> the time to update it or spiff it up. If anyone would like to do the
>>>>>> maintenance or design on it, just let me know and I'll send you all the
>>>>>> particulars.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The thing about Wordpress is it needs constant maintenance and the
>>>>>> number of hackers and attacks have increased tremendously. All the bad guys
>>>>>> want to take down vulnerable worpress sites. It takes more than just a
>>>>>> website, it takes knowledge and experience. Anyone can write a wordpress
>>>>>> site, but keeping it up is another story.  You need lots of good
>>>>>> protections, a foolproof .htaccess file, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's why I have a professional maintaining my site. Someone who
>>>>>> spends every day pruning all the sites under his control. There was a time
>>>>>> when I would maintain a site myself, but I realize that I wear too many
>>>>>> hats already and that I cannot possibly beat his knowledge and expertise.
>>>>>> To date, not one of his sites has ever been hacked.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bob
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11/11/17 4:48 PM, Grimm | Eelco wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What can se do to get the MLA site back in a presentable state? I am
>>>>>> in the process of making contacts at tech companies (Amazon, Google) to get
>>>>>> loudness normalization implemented in streaming services and am embarrassed
>>>>>> to refer my contacts to our website - music-loudness.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Students of mine have build this site in just a day with a Wordpress
>>>>>> template: http://tripleacompany.nl (it is for a 'virtual company'
>>>>>> that they are running as a group proejct in their graduate year).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I could ask if they are willing to make something like this for us.
>>>>>> But we need a domain.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Eelco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> MLA mailing listMLA at grimmaudio.nlhttp://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you want good sound on your album, come to
>>>>>> Bob Katz 407-831-0233 <%28407%29%20831-0233> DIGITAL DOMAIN MASTERING STUDIO
>>>>>> Author: *Mastering Audio              *Digital Domain Website <http://www.digido.com/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However a large number
>>>>>> of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> MLA mailing list
>>>>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> MLA mailing list
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>>>>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> MLA mailing list
>>>>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> MLA mailing list
>>>>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> MLA mailing listMLA at grimmaudio.nlhttp://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> If you want good sound on your album, come to
>>>>> Bob Katz 407-831-0233 <%28407%29%20831-0233> DIGITAL DOMAIN MASTERING STUDIO
>>>>> Author: *Mastering Audio              *Digital Domain Website <http://www.digido.com/>
>>>>>
>>>>> No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However a large number
>>>>> of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> MLA mailing list
>>>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>>>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you want good sound on your album, come to
>>>> Bob Katz 407-831-0233 <%28407%29%20831-0233> DIGITAL DOMAIN MASTERING STUDIO
>>>> Author: *Mastering Audio              *Digital Domain Website <http://www.digido.com/>
>>>>
>>>> No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However a large number
>>>> of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> MLA mailing list
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>>>
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>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> MLA mailing list
>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> MLA mailing list
>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> MLA mailing list
>>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> MLA mailing list
>> MLA at grimmaudio.nl
>> http://grimmaudio.nl/mailman/listinfo/mla_grimmaudio.nl
>>
>>
>
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>
> If you want good sound on your album, come to
> Bob Katz 407-831-0233 <(407)%20831-0233> DIGITAL DOMAIN MASTERING STUDIO
> Author: *Mastering Audio              *Digital Domain Website <http://www.digido.com/>
>
> No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However a large number
> of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
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