<div dir="ltr">We need to get this metadata thing sorted out. AES71 tells you when to use metadata but it doesn't say exactly what it is, how to transport it or what you should do with it. Is this something that we help could flesh out?</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr">Kevin Gross - AVA Networks</div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jun 6, 2018 at 1:22 PM, Bob Katz <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bobkatz@digido.com" target="_blank">bobkatz@digido.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p>I'm in favor of any solution that lowers the recommended target!
But it's always interim. <br>
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<p>-18 LUFS is 5 dB away from -23. It ought to be safe for the
majority of program with an emergency protection limiter, at least
for portable devices. But I would NOT recommend -18 LUFS target
for set top devices playing wide range program material on
loudspeakers. There's the rub and the need for metadata.</p><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
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<p>Bob</p></font></span><div><div class="h5">
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<div class="m_9032733808332111012moz-cite-prefix">On 6/5/18 8:49 PM, Ian Shepherd wrote:<br>
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<p>Maybe the solution for fallback in the absence
of metadata on portable devices we recommend a gain boost
of 7 dB with a protection limiter. Since it's music it's
likely to have a PLR of less than 16 dB so if it was
normalized to -23 it would hardly trigger the limiter. But
without metadata how do you know it's music? And if they
normalize regular program to -23 it will be too low for
many portable devices, also. <br>
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<p>Shit (excuse my French)</p>
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<div>We’ve settled on around -18 LUFS for my podcast, which is
plenty loud on my (European) iPod with stock earbuds.
Anecdotally the BBC seems to be similar, and also works works
fine, for the most part.</div>
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<div>We should look back through our notes for the meeting where
the podcast providers joined in, Bob - from memory most of them
had also settled on -16 or -18, I think.</div>
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<div>I assume your concern is that raising normal program to -16
would trigger excessive limiting, Bob. Perhaps suggesting -18
(which is the median of the AES recommended range) for
everything would be a workable compromise, when there’s no
meta-data ?</div>
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<div>Ian</div>
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