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Hi, Kevin. <br>
<br>
Please use this letter. I inadvertently hit send a moment ago before
finishing:<br>
<br>
<br>
It would be great if you can address just a few items in the
Wikipedia page:<br>
<br>
This sentence is asking for a citation:<br>
<br>
<p style="margin: 0.5em 0px; line-height: 17.92px; color: rgb(37,
37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-style:
normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">The average level of the
average rock song during most of the decade was around −18 dBFS.<sup
class="noprint Inline-Template Template-Fact"
style="line-height: 1; font-size: 11.2px; white-space: nowrap;">[<i><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed"
title="Wikipedia:Citation needed" style="text-decoration:
none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128); background: none;"><span
title="This claim needs references to reliable sources.
(October 2007)">citation needed</span></a></i>]</sup></p>
<br>
This is very ambiguous. It would require assessing the meaning of
the word "average", the method of averaging and the statistical
assessment and the name of the database. The best citation I can
give you is going to require a rewrite:<br>
<br>
You can cite Rudy Ortner's "The Evolution of Loud", masters thesis.
<br>
<br>
German title page: <br>
Je lauter desto bumm! – The Evolution of Loud<br>
Untersuchung zur Evolution der Lautheit und Klangcharakteristik in
60 Jahren westlicher Popularmusik.<br>
<br>
Master-These<br>
Eingereicht am:<br>
Department für Kunst- und Bildwissenschaften<br>
Zentrum für Zeitgenössische Musik<br>
Musikmanagement (MA)<br>
an der Donau-Universität Krems<br>
Betreuer:<br>
Univ.-Ass. Mag.art. Mag.phil. Dr.phil. Werner Goebl<br>
Institut für Wiener Klangstil<br>
Universität für Musik und Darstellende Kunst Wien<br>
Von:<br>
Rudolf Matthias Ortner<br>
9709932<br>
Abgabedatum:<br>
11. September 2012<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<br>
<br>
or use as a secondary reference my graphs which use Ortner's data,
in Mastering Audio: The Art and the Science, Third Edition, Chapter
17. <br>
Ortner's database used as a source for the choice of music: charting
best-selling popular music from four major charts from U.S. , UK and
Germany. He then purchased and obtained compact discs of all these
charting albums. <br>
<br>
The median loudness in LUFS in the three year period in the middle
of the 1980 decade was -16.8 LUFS<br>
<br>
<br>
See if you can live with just the median analysis of the three year
period. Otherwise you'll have to ask Ortner to create a median
measure for each decade from his existing spreadsheets. <br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
Then, "not in citation given". The article writes:<br>
<br>
<meta charset="utf-8">
<span style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline
!important; float: none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">In
the early 1990s, CDs with louder music levels began to surface,
and CD levels became more and more likely to bump up to the
digital limit,</span><sup id="cite_ref-6" class="reference"
style="line-height: 1; unicode-bidi: isolate; font-size: 11.2px;
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-variant: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war#cite_note-6"
style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
white-space: nowrap; background: none;"><span>[</span>note 1<span>]</span></a></sup><span
style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>resulting in recordings
where the peaks on an average rock or beat-heavy pop CD hovered
near 0 dB,</span><sup id="cite_ref-7" class="reference"
style="line-height: 1; unicode-bidi: isolate; font-size: 11.2px;
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-variant: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war#cite_note-7"
style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
white-space: nowrap; background: none;"><span>[</span>note 2<span>]</span></a></sup><span
style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>but only occasionally
reached it.</span><sup id="cite_ref-Stylus_8-0" class="reference"
style="line-height: 1; unicode-bidi: isolate; font-size: 11.2px;
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-variant: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war#cite_note-Stylus-8"
style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
white-space: nowrap; background: none;"><span>[</span></a></sup><br>
<br>
<br>
You can ask Ortner for a very exact interpretation of the meaning of
"only occasionally reached it". I tried to interpret that from his
german spreadsheet but it's over my head. You can ask him at Rudolf
Ortner <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:rudiortner@me.com"><rudiortner@me.com></a> He speaks perfect English. And he
can tell you the exact number of samples out of how many samples
actually reached 0 dBFS sample peak during any period or decade!<br>
<br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
<meta charset="utf-8">
<span style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline
!important; float: none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Engineers,
musicians, and labels each developed their own ideas of how CDs
could be made louder.</span><sup class="noprint Inline-Template
Template-Fact" style="line-height: 1; font-size: 11.2px; color:
rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-style: normal;
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: nowrap;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">[<i><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed"
title="Wikipedia:Citation needed" style="text-decoration:
none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128); background: none;"><span
title="This claim needs references to reliable sources.
(October 2007)">citation needed</span></a></i>]</sup><span
style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> For citation, say that
Milner's book, cited later in the article, makes this a central
theme, in interviews with several Engineers and producers. <br>
<br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
</span></span><br>
<meta charset="utf-8">
<span style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline
!important; float: none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Analysis
suggests that the loudness trend may have peaked around 2005 and
subsequently reduced, with a pronounced increase in overall and
minimum album DR (</span><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crest_factor" title="Crest
factor" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal;
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
line-height: 17.92px; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background: none rgb(255, 255, 255);">crest factor</a><span
style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">) for albums since
2005.</span><sup id="cite_ref-31" class="reference"
style="line-height: 1; unicode-bidi: isolate; font-size: 11.2px;
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-variant: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war#cite_note-31"
style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
white-space: nowrap; background: none;"><span>[</span>29<span>]</span></a></sup><sup
id="cite_ref-SOS_Dynamic_Range_32-0" class="reference"
style="line-height: 1; unicode-bidi: isolate; font-size: 11.2px;
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-variant: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war#cite_note-SOS_Dynamic_Range-32"
style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
white-space: nowrap; background: none;"><span>[</span>30<span>]</span></a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
You can add that Ortner's statistical analysis shows the beginning
of a flat line trend of lou</sup>dness beginning circa 2005. This
may only be because the technical limitations of the processors have
been reached or that there is a true very slight downward trend, or
at least a leveling off.<br>
<br>
<br>
---------<br>
<br>
<meta charset="utf-8">
<span style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline
!important; float: none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Loudness
jumps between broadcast channels and between programmes within the
same channel, and between programs and intervening adverts are a
frequent source of audience complaints.</span><sup class="noprint
Inline-Template Template-Fact" style="line-height: 1; font-size:
11.2px; color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif;
font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; widows: 1; word-spacing:
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: nowrap;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">[<i><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed"
title="Wikipedia:Citation needed" style="text-decoration:
none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128); background: none;"><span
title="This claim needs references to reliable sources.
(November 2010)">citation needed</span></a></i>]</sup><span
style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> <br>
<br>
I think Eelco has a reference for the above (source of audience
complaints)<br>
<br>
-------<br>
<br>
Can we expand the article to include streaming as a growing
concern? Cite statistics showing that downloads and sales have
reduced and streaming has taken over as a prime method of
consuming music, so loudness in streaming is the new area of
concern not generally being normalized, with few exceptions.<br>
<br>
For that citation you can quote Ralph Kessler's research "Audio
Quality on the Internet" which investigates several streaming
services and their targets:<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.masterpinguin.de/AUDIO_QUALITY_ON_THE%20INTERNET_2xA0.pdf">http://www.masterpinguin.de/AUDIO_QUALITY_ON_THE%20INTERNET_2xA0.pdf</a><br>
</span></span> <br>
<br>
----<br>
<br>
You wrote:<br>
<br>
<meta charset="utf-8">
<span style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline
!important; float: none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">In
September 2011, Emmanuel Deruty wrote in<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><i style="color:
rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
line-height: 17.92px; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_on_Sound" title="Sound
on Sound" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
background: none;">Sound on Sound</a></i><span style="color:
rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans: auto;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">, a recording
industry magazine, that the loudness war has not led to a decrease
in dynamic variability in modern music, possibly because the
original digitally-recorded source material of modern recordings
is more dynamic than<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_signal" title="Analog
signal" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal;
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
line-height: 17.92px; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background: none rgb(255, 255, 255);">analogue</a><span
style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 17.92px; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important; float:
none; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>material.</span><sup
id="cite_ref-SOS_Dynamic_Range_32-1" class="reference"
style="line-height: 1; unicode-bidi: isolate; font-size: 11.2px;
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-variant: normal; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 1;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war#cite_note-SOS_Dynamic_Range-32"
style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128);
white-space: nowrap; background: none;"><span>[</span>30<span>]</span></a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Ortner's statistics also show that measured loudness range has not
changed much between 1950 through 2011, On the other hand, as you
mention just below, LRA (statistical variation in loudness defined
by ITU BS.1770-3 or by one of the EBU specs is not necessarily a
judgment of sound quality. (You can cite Lund, Ludwig, Katz,
Atkinson, Ortner, Rogers on this, not sure where to find this in
print other than my book.... Ask Florian, Thomas others to give
you printed citations). <br>
<br>
<br>
You should add Thomas Lund's important research to that next
paragraph, describing PLR. Please ask Thomas to give you a
citation for a printed paper to add to the Katz and Shepherd
citations already given.<br>
<br>
<br>
Also You can cite <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://dr.loudness-war.info/">http://dr.loudness-war.info/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
But keep in mind that various, including Thomas, Florian, are
discouraging the use of the ambiguous abbreviation "DR" and
replace it with PLR. <br>
</sup>-- <br>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="80"><font face="Courier">
If you want good sound on your album, come to
Bob Katz 407-831-0233 </font><font face="Courier">DIGITAL DOMAIN MASTERING STUDIO
Author: <b>Mastering Audio </b></font><font face="Courier">
<a href="http://www.digido.com/">Digital Domain Website</a>
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However a large number
of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.<font color="#ff0000">
<b>No more Plaxo, Linked-In, or any of the other time-suckers.
Please contact me by regular email. Yes, we have a facebook page and a You-Tube site!</b></font></font></pre>
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