[MLA] Normalizing on Tidal

[Bob Katz]

Oh boy, Florian...

So the problem with the Austrian and UK streamers is storage for 
repurposed streaming content?  Ugly. Have you contacted Adrian Wisbey 
about this?

His email is adrian Wisbey <adrian.wisbey at bbc.co.uk>

One way to attack this is to state that the original PLR must continue 
to be maintained for broadcast and that the PLR for streaming should be 
no worse than that required to raise the target to the streaming target.

Another way is to try to get the streamers to invent a special 
normalizing player at the point of origin that will renormalize the 
content on the fly to the streaming target based on metadata that they 
should embed in the original files.


Best wishes,



Bob



On 2/26/16 9:18 AM, florian.camerer at orf.at wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> good stuff I hear from Eelco and Thomas! Keeping fingers crossed...
>
> Re. AES: I am about to enter AES mode and will certainly have something going on at AES in Paris.
> Thomas had the great idea of offering a Streaming Prize for the most R-128-compatible radio stream! :-)
> I will follow up on that.
> Thomas, are you doing another War Tribunal in  Paris?
> Eelco, there should be no issue in organizing a panel where you can present your results.
>
> Not so good news: some  broadcasters are starting to limit their stuff to -8 dBTP, so that when they are repurposing their content for streaming (pushing it to -16 LUFS), the new TP is -1 dBTP..... At least one commercial broadcaster in Austria is doing that (Red Bull Media), and also in the UK, some are starting. Really bad. I have been talking to the Red Bull guys directly, they are very knowledgeable, but their server department does not give them twice the storage......
>
> Best regards, Florian
>
>
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: MLA [mailto:mla-bounces at grimmaudio.nl] Im Auftrag von Grimm | Eelco
> Gesendet: Freitag, 26. Februar 2016 09:35
> An: Music Loudness Alliance
> Betreff: Re: [MLA] Normalizing on Tidal
>
> Hi Thomas,
>
>> BTW, I'm promoting the NormL principle everywhere, but the ideal is of course to have access to a late gain control in a *system*, especially if interfacing from the streaming device is analog. Hopefully Apple has listened...
> Well, Tidal did so for sure. If a company like Roon Labs has the replaygain data, any Tidal integrator has and they are free to implement Norm-l.
>
> In the end that is perhaps the largest step that Tidal set: offering the raw loudness data to app builders that integrate Tidal support, in stead of rendering the loudness data directly in their API (at their own default target level).
>
> I will check with someone who is deep into this streamer code stuff how the loudness metadata rendering in Spotify, Deezer, Qobuz etc is done.
>
> So it all boils down to three questions for streamers:
> 1. Do you offer the raw loudness metadata + raw audio data to downstream services via your API?
> 2. In your own apps: what is the internal target level?
> 3. If the loudness level of a track is lower than that target level, what happens?
>
> I will try to find the answer to question 1. Questions 2 and 3 will be answered soon when we finished our research project for the TV show. I will keep you updated.
>
> All the best,
> Eelco
>
> PS Florian: will there be a loudness panel again at AES Paris? I would be happy to present the results of the research project...
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-- 

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